I'm not sure about how well a 429/460 fits in '67-70's though. While the engine was widely praised in car magazines for its performance, its large weight (720 lbs) was often chastised. Yikes, that's huge! Most of the differences have been listed except for one major difference. Ford created a few high performance variants of the 429, the Boss 429 and the 429 Cobra/Super Cobra Jets. Good luck. Also i was wondering if you hopped them up which one would have more horsepower and which one you could rebuilbd for less money, and which one would be less maintenance? Unless specifically noted this comparison does not include the parts that are unique to the 428 Super Cobra Jet engine. While both shared the same advertised horsepower and torque figures, the 428SCJ wasnt available with air conditioning due to the engines oil cooler location. (REGISTERED USERS DO NOT SEE THIS POST/AD! In 1969, Ford created an even higher performance version, known as the 428 Super Cobra Jet. What is the difference between a 428 and 429. Success at the track meant success at the dealership, and Ford knew this. The factory ratings were intentionally low for insurance reasons. The 429 Ford Cobra Jet pumped out 370 horsepower, while the Super Cobra Jets pushed out 375 horsepower. Ford advertised the 428 Cobra Jet's horsepower at 335 (10 less than the Thunderbird) with 440 lb-ft of torque, and whether those numbers were accurate or not they didn't push past the 390 far enough to generate more than passing interest from the Mustang crowd for its inaugural 1968 year. The CJ had the good heads, cam but had the iron intake. As a result, the 428 was less rev-happy but it gained a low-end torque punch that was absent in the 427. When this 428ci engine was installed in the Mustang, Shelby called the car the GT500. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. As with most deceptions, the ruse was quickly unmasked as the NHRA factored the 428 CJ into higher classes so it couldn't bully weaker machinery. You can have it straight (CJ 428) or with optional CJ 428 Ram, the breathtaker. The difference in displacement between the two was achieved via stroke, with the 429 checking in at 3.590 . are identical. While the Cyclone was named the fastest car of the year, having set a world record speed of 189.22 miles per hour at Daytona, the 428 version wasnt the fastest in the quarter-mile, achieving 18th place overall. 428CJ /SCJ cars used shock tower reinforcements, thicker front sway bars, and beefier springs and shocks. As old as it is, all the valves, springs, retainers, locks, shafts, rockers, etc, should be replaced with at minimum, OEM quality (readily available through "normal" engine parts sources). Over the years, Ford has produced some incredibly iconic cars and engines. Starting in February 1969 this complete package could be ordered as the "Drag Pack" option. Ford 428s had a different water jacket core which can often be identified by the "428" cast in the bottom of the inner water jacket right under the center freeze plug. This summary comparison of major 428 engine components was prepared by Bill Barr, Principal Engineer for the 428 Cobra Jet engine development program at Ford Motor Company. The factory power rating seemed to be a typo. Ford rated the engine at 335 horsepower and 440 lb-ft of torque, but that was probably understated for insurance purposes. Consequently, Ford used Holman Moodys 428 engine as the inspiration it desperately needed to help reclaim its rightful place at the top of the pony car market. The 429 is a 70 complete out of a Lincoln or some other 4 door. If you want to discover which 428 Cobra Jet powered Fords were the fastest muscle cars, how the engine originated, which vehicles had it, and how the 428CJ differs from the 428SCJ, then read on. All of the new Ford Cobra Jets are supercharged, except the Cobra Jet TT from 2013 that has twin-turbos. A lot of people try to pawn off a 390 as a 428. the blocks are nearly identical and the stroke is close. Instead, "Tasca Ford"the second-largest Ford dealership in the world in the 1960sinspired the 428CJ revolution. Super Cobra Jet oil cooler adapter Although the 390 had been offered in the Mustang, the FE had seen incarnations of up to 428 ci. However, it wasnt Ford Engineers that first developed this impressive powerplant. the 428 CJ. The C blocks were later. The cars ran very well and won in the Super Stock category that year. There was some overlap of the C and A markings on the rear block face which means many early CJ's have the A on the block while many police and pasenger 428 engines have the C marking. ), http://www.gessford.com/images/428-03.gif, http://www.gessford.com/images/428cobrajet.htm, http://www.gessford.com/images/FordMuscleStory.htm, http://www.428cobrajet.com/cj-vs-scj.html. For improved high speed reliability, the SCJ used the . For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Say Cyclone CJ. It's important to note that all other components of the SCJ engine do in fact interchange with the CJ engine. The rarest of the bunch are the 68's. The most vaulable Cobra Jet is the 1968 Shelby GT500KR convertibles, which can go for as much or more than a BOSS 429. All this was none too soon. (The hood scoop works.) The most iconic are probably the Ford Cobra Jet Mustangs, which won numerous drag racing championships. Cobra Jet engines received low-riser heads with a "rough-cast" combustion chamber (2.09int.-1.66ex. Performance options aplenty: tach, styled steel wheels, power front disc brakes, power steering, Traction-Lok differential (3.50, 3.91 or 4.30 axel ratios), bucket seats, racing mirroryou name it. Comparison of Major 428 Engine Components, 1968 428 Cobra Jet Drag Strip Modifications, 428 CJ Mustangs at the 1968 NHRA Winternationals, Classic Mustang Warranty Plate/Certification Label Decoder, Cast iron, similar to PI with revised carburetor bore risers, relocated carburetor pad, and radiused riser to upper and lower logs to improve fuel/air distribution, Production 390 GT cast iron light car manifolds, Redesigned high flow, low restriction unique to the 428 CJ, Redesigned dual inlet with hot/cold start-up system. chuck, The same naming convention was applied to the 429 engine as well. Get exclusive muscle car content, giveaways, and a FREE Report on 10 of the most powerful muscle cars ever made right to your inboxabsolutely free! It may be possible to mix components if every component of the reciprocating assembly is dynamically balanced, but why bother? A forum community dedicated to Mercury Cougar owners and enthusiasts. The Model T has long been considered one of the greatest manufacturing feats in modern history, and Fords flathead engine transformed V8s for the future. The 428's and 429's most associated with Cougars are Cobra Jets. Kevin later explicitly confirmed that "Ford did not produce 69 4.30 vehicles with Detroit Lockers. The 390 Mustang was getting abused at the drag strip by Chevrolets new 396 powered Camaro. The Mercury division of Ford put the 428 Cobra Jet in their Comets and Cyclones, and Shelby used one for his new GT500KR (King of the Road). Come join the discussion about restoration, performance, modifications, classifieds, troubleshooting, maintenance, and more! However, in true Cobra Jet fashion, Ford underestimated the horsepower from the factory. 1968 was the only second year of the Cougar, which only received minor revisions, including side marker lights and front shoulder belts. According to the excellent Boss and Cobra Jet Mustangs by Dr. John Craft, this is how the Cobra Jet was born. I think, but don't remember, that the SCJ would come in cars optioned with the "drag pack.". The '69-'70 Mustangs were nearly identical cars featuring minor cosmetic changes. The 1975 MPC clearly notes that the 1969 and 1970 radiator core supports were serviced using two different part numbers (C9ZZ-16138-A and D0ZZ-16138-A); the report I have is that the 1970 support is shaped in such a way that the bracket doesnt fit and isnt needed. Ford was not caught in flagrante delecto, however. The "SUPER" mark does NOT mean that the pistons were used only in SCJs! The 428 Police Interceptor Engine The 428 police interceptor engine could be found on both the 1967 Shelby GT500 and the 1968 GT500KR. "A standard 428 will have a U1 crankshaft ballanced on the inside of the ballancer but weight added on crankshaft . 1968 was the year the wild Mustangand all other Ford modelsfell prey to the untamed Cougar. However, the original Mustang platform, as popular as it was, could not accept the larger engines Ford already had in its product lineup, because the engine compartment was simply too small. Lets check out the eight fastest Ford Muscle Cars powered by a 428CJ and 428SCJ, shall we? Can be ID'd be block casting numbers of C8SE, C9VE, D0VE, D1VE among others and head casting numbers of C8SE, C9VE, D0VE among others. Grue up with Ford FE. The 428, on the other hand, has a smaller bore and longer stroke producing more torque and is well-suited to street-strip action. The largest was the 390 cid, which Ford first brought out in 1961. The basic strength of the Super Cobra Jet engine is in a more durable reciprocating assembly (crank, rods, pistons, wrist pins, flywheel/flexplate, and harmonic balancer) that was designed to withstand the higher RPM requirements of drag racing. Register now for free! Cobra Make, Engine: Posts: 717. This explains why Ford went with the 390 in the Mustang instead of the 427. Now. The new 2008 Ford Cobra Jet Mustangs were built strictly for the drag strip, so they werent even given VINs. In response to the Camaro, in mid-1967 Carroll Shelby created the first Shelby GT500 Mustang. The original production run only lasted for six years, from 1968-1974, but it made an incredibly outsized impact. With the elimination of the 428 Ford Cobra Jets after 1970, this left only the measly, low compression 351 Cobra Jet as the only one remaining for 1972-74. 3) An oil cooler Carroll Shelby, famous for his GT350 version of the Mustang as well as for the Cobra, became involved when he decided to produce a big-block version of his Shelby Mustang GT series. We have 2 blocks here-both are 428s but one has some additional webbing on the main bearings. In sixth place is the 1969 Mercury Cougar Eliminator. The 429 is known as a 385 family due, I believe, to the bore size being 385 centimeters. A date code correct 69 428 block could be worth a decent buck. You true FE gurus can add/correct info to the above. 429 Cobra Jet and Super Cobra Jet Vehicle Applications. The value of a Cobra Jet will differ, depending on the body style, options, and year of the car. If I can, I will try to get a picture of the "SUPER" stamp to show. Piston part numbers are marked (R) for red size and (B) for blue size to note options for selective fit based on normal production tolerances. Either way, you can be guaranteed it will be a monster at the drag strip and not be lacking for power. The baddest of them all is the Boss 429. Ford discontinued the 429 Cobra Jet and Super Cobra Jet options after 1971, largely due to the increasing emissions restrictions. In 1969, 10 different Mustang engine options were available. I have the option to purchase either one of them. This is an internally ballance assy . Lots of people have different opinions about the "Drag Pack" option described above, what it included, and which cars it was available for. Compression was lowered from 10.7:1 to 9.0:1, and in 1971 it actually made 5 horsepower less than the standard 351 at 280 horsepower. Ford branded the new 428 the Ford Cobra Jet engine, and they also put it in the Fairlane and Torino. although the fastest factory car i have ever been in was and is to this day the 68 428scj mustang, and those cars are cars of record winning the 68' winternationals against the Hemi cars. stronger. The 428 CJ and SCJ blocks have extra main bearing webbing and thicker main caps than the normal 390 or 428. Unlike the 351, Ford based the 428 Cobra Jet and Super Cobra Jets on the FE series of engines. In addition, the Spoiler II was available in either a red or blue paint schemehonoring legendary NASCAR drivers Cale Yarborough and Dan Gurney, respectively. I was wondering if anyone knows the difference between a regular 428 block and a 428 Cobra Jet block. Just as long as they dont add gimmicky speakers with faux-engine noise, like some of their competitors. p.s. The valves are bigger but the real improvement is the exhaust port which is both wider internally and straighter plus higher exit point in the casting. One had spun on the crank bearing and all would have had to be resized, so Bill advised me. The 428 uses a crank with a 3.98 inch stroke and a 390 has a 3.78 inch crank. Untamed European elegance indeed. Cast iron intake manifold identical to the aluminum one on the police interceptor. The 396 was known in Bow Tie circles as the Mark IV and was further known as the "mystery motor" because it was developed in secret for the '64 Daytona 500. The basic casting is the same, but a 428 had a 4.13 inch bore and the 390 has a 4.05 bore stock. So there was an overlapping period of perhaps a year from say June 1967 until June 1968 when both types were being made and used, apparently for both CJ and non - CJ applications. Some SCJ block had the word "super" stamped on the rear. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Great article, but the 68 Cougar wasnt offered as a convertible! one basic block for both the 429 and 460 with a 4.360-inch bore. The Super Cobra Jets got forged aluminum pistons and higher performance camshafts, as well as a high-rise intake manifold. Yet, Ford did not use any of the second generation big blocks in pony cars like the Mustang at first. But times were changing, and sales were soft for performance cars across the board, and not just at Ford. Ford, realizing the sin of allowing the last Cobra Jet production engine to be the lukewarm 351 Cleveland Cobra Jet, finally revived the badging in 2008. There were slight differences in the base and higher trim Ford Cobra Jets, yet they were all rated the same 335 horsepower, likely meaning Ford was really sandbagging the numbers the whole time. Also, 1969 was the last year of production for the famous Mustang GT. Super Cobra Jet horn reinforcement bracket In third place is the 1969 Ford Mustang Mach 1. In the November 1969 issue of Super Stock and Drag Illustrated magazine, a 70 Mach 1 made a 14.11-second quarter-mile pass, traveling 101.1 miles per hour. The Ford Cobra Jet and Super Cobra Jet were introduced in 1970, and they were improvements over the 428s. It came in special Mustangs (and 2 Cougars) in 1969-70. The Ford 427 became immortalized in 1966, when Ken Miles piloted it during the 1966 24 Hours of Le Mans (later chronicled in Ford v. Ferrari). Super Cobra Jet horn jumper wire. Also does the cj have a lot of low end. The 1969 Ford Fairlane Cobra was a 1969-only option and was available in either a Formal Roof Hardtop or a Fastback form. Pictures of some of these parts can be found in the component identification section of this web site. The Mustang now had company in the ponycar market, and the new Camaro was no slouch. Starting in 1966, you could also get a 428 Police Interceptor (only sold to police entities). However, there were a few key internal differences between the two engines. : For registered members this ad will NOT show. The 428 Cobra Jet was born by drag racers at a Ford Dealership to nudge FoMoCo in the right direction when they needed it most to help recapture the pony car market. The engine was widely praised for its performance and design, and it was by far the most powerful Ford production motor available. Lastly, Ford engineers externally balanced the SCJ engine with a counterweight behind a different harmonic balancer because they removed the center counterweight on the crank. Two-bolt main block Between 345-360 horsepower 428 Super Cobra Jet Internal structure differences included Lemans type cap screw rods The main bearing journal diameter measures between 2.7484 and 2.7492 inches. Makes you wonder how many were built at the other plants. ID by casting number on the block of C9AE. The Cobra Jet package added $287.60 to the sticker price of a Cyclone. An improved crank and rods were also part of the deal. Upgrade available to low restriction ram air (seal to hood) and "shaker" hood with hot/cold start-up system, Larger bolts; SCJ had material addedto outside of big end, Retuned damper for strengthened crankshaft, Revised valve springs for higher valve toss speed (6700 RPM), Improved material with modified, polished backside fillet radius, Unique adapter with oil in and oil out provisions for external oil cooler (SCJ only), Unique high (90%+) nodular iron with 10,000 RPM burst strength; high RPM clutch assembly, Higher relief valve pressure, unique oil filter adapter, and external oil cooling (SCJ only), Automatic and manual transmission available, Automatic and manual transmission available. The 428's and 429's most associated with Cougars are Cobra Jets. The CJ block differs from the plain 428 due to the additional webs cast into the main bearing saddles. However, the Ford production database describes the car as having an S-code 3.50:1 traction-lok rear. The 1967 Shelby GT500 featured a new 428 cid engine that had been used in the Thunderbirds and Galaxies. I want to register an account for free right now! In April 1968, Ford introduced the Cobra Jet, built from a 428 Police Interceptor short block with 427 low riser heads, among other heavier-duty performance partssimilar to what Holman Moody had invented. YES! See if you can determine if these motors you are looking at are CJ's. For the 429 Ford Cobra Jet carbs, there were either 715 cfm or 780 cfm 4 bbl options. In fact, Ford had seen the writing on the wall. Because of the long throw, the 428 was more of a low rpm / torque motor were as the 427 was a high rpm race motor. Note that the explanation says that three other cars were built like this at San Jose! At the '68 NHRA Winternationals in Pomona, California, Ford entered a number of specially warmed-up '68 Cobra Jet Mustangs. Note that it was not thought to be possible to order an SCJ engine by itself -- the only way to get your hands on an SCJ in a Mustang was to order the optional 3.91:1 or 4.30:1 rear end gear ratios. Ranging from common problems info to performance modification guides, we cover everything muscle car. Most 428s in 7 liter [COLOR=#0000ff! The Boss and Cobra Jets had the same block with four bolt mains, short skirts, and thin wall castings. Although the Mustang had been completely redone, little changed in the CJ engine for 1969, and it was still available in any type of Mustang. 428 Police Interceptor, and 429 ThunderJet, used in big luxury cruisers. When identifying a Super Cobra Jet, you cant do it by the VIN as it shares the same R and Q code designations as the Cobra Jet. They were the be-all and end-all of rods back in the sixties, but metallurgy has far surpassed them today.
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